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Talk:Arnett McMillan/@comment-27788729-20160523202720/@comment-28400905-20160531204125
@Eevee2011: Oh, right, I guess I was just thinking about the current plan in the plot, totally forgot that, real sorry. You seem to be misunderstanding me, I was pretty sure I said I'm not arguing that Elly, or anyone, has 'secretly' had a desire to be with Kazuya all along. That's not what I'm saying. At all. And I agree, we did establish all Pandora will feel the same way, probably, about Kazuya's Freezing, I totally agree with you there. Where I stop agreeing with you is when you say 'Su-Na loves Gengo' and 'Holly loves Louis' since, though they may be like that now, if they ever had their hearts synchronized with Kazuya's heart they'd instantly feel more strongly and care more deeply for Kazuya (or Kazuya's Freezing, I'll defer to your point that it isn't necessarily Kazuya's person) then they ever did for Gengo or Louis. We know this from canon already. The situation seems to be, so far as I can tell, that for some reason every Pandora always cares more about this thing called the 'Stigmatic Body' then they care about anything else in their lives. Holly might say she 'loves' Louis but, if exposed to the 'Stigmatic Body' then she'd, of her own free will, say that she wants to be its servant and offer everything up and all that junk. Also, sorry for being petty again, but can I just take a moment to vent that it makes me incredibly sad that though we've got messed up relationships like Louis and Holly, it was André and Elly, Arnett and Morrison, Ticy and Abel whose relationships got messed with. It makes me sad to know that Holly's most intimate and happy scenes ever are going to be with Louis, but I'll never get to see depicted Elly being as happy and intimate with André as she's now been with Kazuya. That's really depressing for me as a fan of the couple. The Ticy and Abel part particularly stings since we final got to see a major milestone in their relationship, recently, with exactly how dedicated to Ticy Abel is, and what he's willing to do for her, but there's no relationship payoff. We don't even get a scene of Ticy seeming to really care about what happened, but we do get a scene of her writhing naked before Kazuya. That just feels like such a let down to me. One of the things which really depresses me is that three of the couples I like the most, my favourite really, will now forever have their female halves be depicted as having had their most intimate and happy experiences with Kazuya, whilst I'll never see depicted the couples themselves experiencing something intimate and happy. If they were just ignored that would be fine, because then what happened in Pair Love Stories would always be the most intimate and happy we see them, but now Elly, Arnett and Ticy's most intimate and happy experiences I'll ever see are with Kazuya, never with André or Morrison or Abel. And as a fan of these couples in a story, so I like reading these couples in the story, that leaves me feeling really hollow. I can't really think of a story where love interests have their most intimate and happy scenes with someone other than their romantic partner but now, in Freezing, that's gonna be the case for all three my favourite couples. Anyway, sorry for getting side tracked, back on point; so to be clear I'm not saying there always existed a 'secret attraction'. Clearly those feelings only started now, recently. But! As we've established their minds, emotions and thoughts were not manipulated and nothing occurred against their free will or was expressed against their free will, so, that means, they must have meant, believed and wanted everything they thought and said, yes? Or if you do differ on this point, how do you differ? If its their free will then its what they mean, its what they want and its what they believe. Put another way; how do I interpret Elly saying and thinking of her own free will 'I want to be Kazuya's obedient servant' or 'I want to offer up everything I have to Kazuya' as anything other than, well, that Elly means both those things? Yeah, for me it definitely more then sucks (but that's me personally just) but I do already understand it doesn't perturb most people. Not to surprising considering the reaction on most comment boards and such when the chapters came out were all about how cool 'NTR king Kazuya is' and how 'awesome NTR aura' was as a power. I guess the problem is I just naturally thought; 'how painful that must feel for someone in one of those relationships'. But yeah I do doubt people will really care if Elly leaves André, or more likely stops caring for him more than she cares for Kazuya (I doubt a harem will ever happen because Kazuya's made clear his devotion to Satella). To be honest more than enough people have already expressed they'd enjoy it. The 'drug talking' thing is starting to confuse me, and I think its starting to get complicated, particularly since when you say 'I'm only thinking this way cause of the Freezing' that sounds like mind control to me because it means something external is manipulating their thoughts against their will. So instead I'll ask a question more straight forwardly cause I think that'll maybe clear up some of the confusion; When Elly expresses all those things she expresses (under Kazuya's Freezing), is she of her own free will believing, thinking and feeling them or is an external force compelling them upon her against her will?